Interview With An Anti Masker, Toronto's Chris Sky
Friday, August 28
By Jorah Kai. Chongqing, China
When I heard that months after China, South Korea, Japan, New Zealand, Mongolia, and other sensible countries had adopted masks in public to cut the spread of the deadly COVID-19 pandemic, parts of Canada had finally moved from a suggestion to a legal mandate requiring face masks be worn on public transit, and in public buildings I was elated.
The science was unequivocal: with no vaccine in sight, only non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPI) 's had a chance of slowing and reducing the exponential growth of COVID-19 cases globally, and when everyone wore masks in close situations, the spread could be reduced by more than 99%.
My family is mainly in Canada, and I felt more comfortable knowing they were safe, and the pandemic was being dealt with scientifically and intelligently. So, when the backlash emerged, and a group of unscientific yahoos (according to Ontario Premier Doug Ford) gathered and protested the "loss of freedom" without masks, it was a real shock.
Among them, one man emerged as a leader. His name was Chris Sky. He led parades of anti-maskers into shopping malls. Generally, many people ignored and gave him a pass. I couldn't help but wonder what his side of the story was, so I thought I would try to meet him halfway and give him a fair chance to express his views without judgment.
At least, I'd try. Here's what happened.
July 15, 2020, 16:24
Jorah: Hey, I heard you wanted evidence on why we should wear masks. I'd be happy to send some over; maybe we could discuss it together?
July 17, 2020, 20:37
Jorah: If you want to contribute a piece-- here are some questions for you tell your side
1) Can you describe your morning routine and stress levels? Are you sleeping well? What's your work situation, and how is your household "hanging in there"?
2)What are you working on these days?
3) What's the biggest issue, situation, or problem on your mind these days, locally or globally, and how do you feel about it? What are the challenges to solving it, and how's it going?
4)How do you feel about the uneven global response to the pandemic, where some countries have all but beaten it, and other countries are experiencing exponential growth and failing healthcare systems?
5)Any thoughts you want to share?
He finally answered me on August 19. A few days before, he had hosted a party at Cherry Beach against social distancing and mask use. At that party, several men claimed to be assaulted with wrenches and returned with chainsaws to cut apart Chris' DJ booth and equipment. Chris later posed, all without masks, with two police officers that responded to calls of violence.
As shocking as the story was, the public sentiment was mostly in support of the two bloody men who attacked the party with chainsaws. For the peaceful Canadian people to side with the chainsaw, attackers give you an idea of how unpopular Chris Sky's views are outside of his fringe element of cherry-picked party people.
Toronto police are investigating a recent post by one of their Instagram pages in which officers amplified one of Canada's most recognizable anti-mask conspiracy theorists.
The photo, which was first reported on by CBC News, was posted on an Instagram page called @TPSNeighbourhoodWatch, an account connected to the Toronto Police force's 51 Division. It shows two smiling officers flanking Chris Sky, a well-known anti-mask crusader who was recently involved in a series of illegal raves at Toronto's Cherry Beach in protest of physical distancing, mandatory masks, and other public health measures.
August 19, 2020, 09:43
Chris: Lockdown is. It requires. Mandatory masks are not about safety and blind compliance with the removal of your rights is beyond ignorant (unintelligible)
Jorah: Hey, Chris, I know we have very different points of view, but would you be interested in explaining your point of view on the COVID crisis?
In book one, it was just my experience; in the second, forthcoming book, I have guest writers from all over the world and welcome you to present your viewpoint so people can understand it.
Chris: Give me more info and I will consider it.
Jorah: Sure. I'm just at the gym, that's something we both enjoy, right? I will send a message when I'm done. Today it's cardio, chest, and swimming.
Chris: I may be sleeping as its 4 am where I am.
Jorah: Yeah, no worries. Take your time.
I can give you my nutshell while I am warm-up. I woke up in China on January 23 to lockdowns and an escaping virus. We were told to wear masks or stay home (or be jailed). It was quite scary. That said, the strong response worked, and by mid-March, schools and gyms were opening again. So my premise is mask use, and staying home stops the virus.
However, I've seen you have a different and strong opinion. I'd like my book to have different views from diverse people. Let the reader decide what they think is right, or maybe everyone just has their perspective.
Chris: Lol, we have no emergency period.
(Editor's note: a strong, healthy 19-year-old described as a phenomenal athlete just died of COVID-19 in Montreal after this interview took place)
Our 493 Ontario hospitals have 50 COVID patients. China is having mass concerts, gatherings.
Jorah: Now we are, yes.
Chris: Sweden and Japan never locked down and have no masks and have done better than (unintelligible). No, not now. Our hospitals were never full and were empty hundreds of before masks (unintelligible)
Jorah: What about 6 million cases in the USA, though?
Chris: That's all bullsh*t. In the USA, they count everything as COVID.
Jorah: If you're interested, you can google "CTV news China lockdown Kai wood" or my blog "theinvisiblewar.co" - lots of facts there for you in my CTV News reporting on China's outbreak and what we know about it.
Chris: It's cool, bro. I'm not interested in wasting my time on the sheep. Wear your mask stay home ignore reality.
Jorah: I would be really happy to hear your argument. Anytime no rush. I know we disagree, but hey, maybe you'll even convince me. Either way, I'll publish it honestly won't twist your words.
Chris: Not interested. Ignorance and fear, and denial of reality are all you express.
Jorah: If I'm willing to go to you and hear your point of view, isn't that something?
Chris: Have a nice day and please leave me alone I have important work to do and no time to waste on the ignorant.
Jorah: Anyway, I won't push it on you, think about it, if you change your mind - if you're brave enough to debate science, let me know.
Chris: If you haven't figured out what's going on by now, you are a lost cause best of luck
Jorah: I wish I could have your POV articulated, but I'll look elsewhere— up to you. Good luck anyway, Gym time Is your gym open yet?
One of the best parts of the strong response is the fact that in China, we are back to normal; all the early use of masks and distancing made our cities safe again with some vigilance. Clinging to a notion of freedom while endangering others only prolongs the necessary loss of liberties.
Chris: People like you ignore reality and all evidence. Proof you dismissed Japan and Sweden, which are examples of no mask no lockdown doing better than countries on full lockdown with masks.
Your irrelevant counterpoint, what about the USA does not address the fact that no lockdown and no mask did better than lockdown and mask everywhere else. We call this cognitive dissonance, not science lol so unless you can address how japan did better than virtually any country without any lockdown or mandatory... you have no argument for masks or lockdown. #truth (sic, unintelligible mumbling)
Make sure you read the part where they won't mandate masks in the Netherlands because there is no scientific evidence they work!
Chris links this article: Dutch government will not advise public to wear masks - minister
'SCIENCE' NEWSflash if even one scientist contradicts a narrative, it cant be proven either way. Hence mandatory is wrong as it pretends the science is settled and that we need to give up our freedom of choice. That's bullsh*t for weak, ignorant, scared fools.
Jorah: Cool, you are passionate. I like that.
This article uses the old, "if people don't know how to wear a mask, it's worse than no masks" argument some countries rolled out in January. It's a facile, ridiculous, and childish argument, akin in my mind to suggesting shoes are dangerous because they could cause strangulation or drowning if improperly worn.
Chris: Here are 600 doctors in the USA brave enough to speak out
600 Physicians Say Lockdowns Are A 'Mass Casualty Incident.'
So once again, "mandatory" masks then tracing then vaccines are not about health it's about control.
Jorah: I'll check the links, as I said, I'm at the gym lifting weights, it's not an ideal time for research, but you said it's the only time you're available. This article seems to suggest that there is a cost to lockdowns, but ignores the cost of letting a century pandemic spread to the world.
The last one, 1918-1920 Spanish Flu killed 50-100 million people, 1% of the world's population at the time.
If you're open to it, you should lay the argument out for my readers and convince them.
Chris: And btw. The government is exempt from these laws.
No like speaking to intelligent and informed audiences. Not an audience of TV watchers that can understand what I'm saying.
And you failed my challenge.
You can't address how Japan did better than virtually any country with no lockdown or mandates.
So address Japan. Or admit you're wrong. Simple.
Japan addresses your mask argument. ... so as I know I've already won the debate.
Jorah: Does the fact that China used masks, and now we have no virus mean anything to you? Meanwhile, places that argue about masks keep having infected and lockdowns? Is that a coincidence, you think?
I'm listening. I'm also at the gym - We can talk tomorrow if that's better.
Chris: Japan.
Jorah: The Japanese wore masks and socially distanced and don't shake hands.
Chris: Deflection and irrelevance. Japan: no lockdown no masks (they) did better than anywhere
Jorah: Are you in Japan? What's your proof they didn't wear masks?
I'm in China, closer. All the pictures we saw were subways and streets full of people wearing masks. It's part of the Asian culture. They're very considerate people.
Chris: They had no mandate. And no lockdown.
Jorah: They didn't need a mandate or lockdown because they did the right thing voluntarily. When it was suggested.
Chris: Irrelevant
Jorah: In Canada, we finally had a government mandate and lockdown because people like you wouldn't voluntarily do your part to stop the spread of COVID-19.
Chris: No mandatory masks or lockdown
Jorah: Only western countries are resistant to masks.
Chris: Facts, not opinion.
Jorah: This is where we see the out of control spread. So they require mandates.
Chris: Facts, not opinion. Nobody In Sweden wears masks.
Jorah: Sweden is largely considered a colossal error.
Swedish Faith in Covid Strategy Plunges After Errors ...
www.bloomberg.com › news › articles › sweden-won-t-a...
June 3, 2020 - Swedes' confidence in their country's handling of the Covid-19 crisis ... of Sweden's government to speak out, with the health minister, Lena ... More controversially, he rejects face masks as useful protection against the virus.
How Sweden fought coronavirus, and what went wrong
www.cnbc.com › 2020/07/17 › how-sweden-fought-coro...
July 17, 2020 - Sweden kept its country relatively open during the coronavirus pandemic, but it's elderly ... CNBC is looking at how places around the world have tackled Covid-19. ... That includes wearing masks or avoiding discretionary travel. ... Prime Minister Stefan Lofven admitted in June that the country did not go far ...
Chris: They are just fine lol. (mumbling)
Jorah: Sweden is widely considered a failure. Many people died; their death tolls are much higher than neighboring countries that used non-pharmaceutical interventions such as masks and distancing. The minister is very regretful.
Chris: Sweden is not a failure less dead per capita than Italy and the UK and France.
Jorah: Those are much larger countries that had a much higher exposure initially. Comparing to Finland and the Netherlands might be a better comparison, and in that one, they do very poorly.
Do you know many cases are long haulers - Months long battles, recurring symptoms, organ damage.
Chris: Stop lying.
Jorah: It's true. Lung scarring, strokes in 20-year-olds in New York, it is quite a scary disease.
Chris: See how people like you ignore facts, abuse opinion, and then lie?
Jorah: No, I'm not ignoring I'm listening.
Chris: You haven't addressed Japan or Sweden
Jorah: I have, and you haven't said anything smart yet, haven't made a compelling case for me.
Chris: Sure bro. I proved you wrong, and you re grasping at straws lol.
How did Japan and Sweden do better than countries with lockdown and mandates? If they are so necessary - (you) haven't addressed this once. Not one fact or a piece of data
Jorah: I did actually. Japanese did the right things without requiring government intervention, and Sweden was a failure and tragedy.
So your whole thing is you don't believe masks work?
Chris: Opinion means f*ck all
Jorah: If you read one good study, you would change your mind?
Oxford COVID-19 study: face masks and coverings work – act ...
www.ox.ac.uk › news › 2020-07-08-oxford-covid-19-s...
July 8, 2020 - Cloth face coverings, even homemade masks made of the correct material, are effective in reducing the spread of COVID-19 - for the wearer ..
Masks for coronavirus now have more scientific evidence ...
www.vox.com › future-perfect › masks-coronavirus-co...
July 15, 2020 - Studies increasingly show masks for coronavirus work. ... The growing scientific evidence for masks to fight Covid-19, explained. It's true the ...
Chris: No, my whole thing is lockdown and mandates are not required
And you cant prove otherwise- LOL.
Jorah: Oh. So masks are good but not lockdowns?
Chris: Masks are fine if you wanna wear one. It becomes an issue when it's a mandate bc then you get mandated contract tracing and vaccines. (sic, unintelligible)
Also a fact, and freedom is essential.
Jorah: Even the freedom to die?
Chris: Masks and lockdown are not essential
Jorah: Even the freedom to kill your grandma?
Chris: Now you're being ridiculous
Jorah: Or your niece with cancer?
Chris: How about facts, not what-ifs. Pathetic (sic, unintelligible)
Jorah: Am I? Let's say you get COVID. But you're strong, don't get sick. But you see your gran, and she does. And she dies. Was it ok? If she gives it to 100 older people and they all die for your freedom, was that ok?
Chris: If shes Old or sick, it's her responsibility to wear a mask if you think that helps or protects herself by distancing or staying home. The entire world is responsible for their own personal health. You are not responsible (sic, unintelligible) for me or my mother or your mother.
Jorah: Was your freedom worth 100 old people? Our most vulnerable? Our children?
Chris: And once again, bullsh*t. You haven't used one fact. Emotional hyperbole is not an argument dummy. Lol.
Jorah: But science says if she wears a mask and you talk to her, and you have it it's 30% protection. If you both wear a mask, it's 99% protection. That's a fact I read.
Chris: Ya, if you re sick, which 99% of people are not. Lol.
Jorah: So, that means if we care about our old and sick. We should all wear them, right?
Chris: No, that's not what it means. Not at all, so please stop.
Jorah: Also, what about the long term organ damage in young people?
Chris: You have not said one fact.
Jorah: Have you considered that? There's so much we still don't know, and (we) need to be careful.
Chris: Not one.
Jorah: As I said, I'm at the gym, and we can talk later if you want a debate with more facts, but this is the only time you've made yourself available…
Chris: I don't consider emotional hyperbole I consider facts and data w (sic, unintelligible)
Jorah: I don't have access to facts other than what I remember. But I wrote a book on COVID-19 and published it, so I remember a fair bit.
Chris: Ok
Good me too
No thanks ... (sic, unintelligible)
Jorah: We can agree there.
Chris: You are an idiot.
Jorah: Let's continue the interview tomorrow, then? You must be getting tired.
Chris: No.
Jorah: Thanks for your time.
At this point, Chris refused to engage and cut off all contact on social media.
"If you want to wear a mask, wear a mask. If you want to get contact traced, get contact traced, if you want to get a vaccine, get a vaccine, but you're not going to tell us what to do." - Chris Sky, on CTV News July 7, 2020
Kai shares his diaries of the 2020 pandemic and all its challenges with iChongqing. The first collection is to be published soon as 'Kai's Diary' in China and 'The Invisible War' internationally. The second collection is tentatively named 'The Lighthouse.' You can read them all on his blog, also, www.theinvisiblewar.co.
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